new member with ats60

Hi

pleased to have found a h k forum, brilliant amps and so much cooler than all these other makes.

well here is my queestion i love my ats60 lovely sound on clean and the pre amp valve dist. channel

mine still has the original h k pre amp valve so after much discussion and detective work decided to buy a spare valve and got a harma retro cryo [supposed to sound like a mullard- but if it does then im not sure what all the fuss is about mullards]  im not one for believing valve amps are the only thing to have - im not sure the sound is better just different BUT i tried this new valve just to see what it was like and it seems harsher than the original valve from h k. can anyone let me know who makes these valves for h k unfortunatly other than being able to read h k the rest has rubbed off.

can anyone help

thank you

kevin
ps there didnt seem anywhere to put this post so thought i would leave it here-sorry.

Ooh I feel mild controversy coming on.  Hope it's good natured and helpful.

You will come across a lot of conflicting opinion in this area.  The starting point is to decide whether there actually will be a predictable change in sound when you swap out a valve.  For myself, I always say I'm not a believer of magic components.  No one can ever tell the difference in blind listening tests and that is the only criteria on which to make a decision, (imho).  Guitar tone caps for example.  600V orange drop v 400V?  It's utter nonsense that, in a guitar, there should be, let alone you can hear, any difference!  I doubt if even extremely expensive measurement equipment could show one.  Valves however, being almost in a sense electro-mechanical and relying heavily on the details of their physical design for their effects, I can see there being differences here.  But the jury is out as to whether there is a 'night and day' change.  And whether these differences would be totally predictable is another question.

Is there enough difference in sound between valves in the same range to swamp general differences in the same valve models of different manufacturers?  In other words someone may experience a smoothing of tone when changing from a valve from A to one from B.  Does that mean B's valves are smoother than A's, or does it mean they got a very smooth sounding valve from the edge of B's range when they started with a very coarse sounding valve from the opposite end of A's range, even though in general A's are usually smoother than B's?  What would that person say about the two valves?  See what I mean? There is no way of quantifying things here unless you deal with many many valves and can come to some sensible 'average' based decision.

There are some who say there is sufficient difference for predictability here.  Maybe in their case there was, or could it just be that they describe things in a more acute way.  In other words they see a tiny difference as highly significant whereas someone else would see it as - well - detectable but overall insignificant!  How do we describe 'significant' in tone terms?  The results and the reporting of those results are highly subjective.  Hyperbole (hype) and placebo are unfortunate confusing factors in this field.  So I would sit down, buckle in, and prepare for some varying recommendations.

And I'm still waiting to get to a definitive answer on this question myself as I have found that my own TM36 has really mellowed with use since I posted something on this issue.  I now have a much sweeter tone out of the stock valves after a few months of playing.  Hahaha!  But playing in the speakers from new could also be a factor in that too.  (See what I mean, it's like trying to unravel knitted spaghetti!)

Hi

thanks for replying. yes it seems a minefield and im not wanting conroversy in any way.

just my ears seemed to find the original h k valve smoother- not saying it is but my ears seems to think so

i suppose cutting through all my waffle im just trying to find out if anyone knows anything about the h k printed pre amp valve so i can replace like for likeon my ats60 from the 80's


many thanks

kevin