Behringer FCB1010 - What's your setup / how do you use yours?

I'm looking at a Behringer FCB1010 w/ UNO mod to use with my GMD40. For those that have one, how well does it work with the GMD40, what quirks have you noticed, what pitfalls/shortcomings have you learned to get around, and, if you knew going in what you know now, would your purchase change or would you do things exactly the same way?

Thanks in advance,

~ Patrick

Does anyone have a more in-depth listing of the midi chart that comes in the GMD40 user manual? The chart given shows controller numbers and their corresponding programming changes, but doesn't give any more information than that.

EXAMPLE: Controller number 12 is set aside for Mod-FX Type. Ok, but at what point does it switch? Since the selection is normally done with a radial digital potentiometer on the front of the amp, how wide is the band, e.g. 1 through 128 steps? If so, does that make switching between effects go 1-32, 33-64, 65-96, 97-128? What's the break point of the switching? Same with Controller number 26 for modulation speed, is it 1-128 as well? The manual doesn't say.

Basically, I'm asking because I'll be getting an FCB1010 and an UNO EEPROM in a few days and I'd like to use the stomp box feature to set up modulation effect changes. But, without better information than what is given in the manual it's going to mean a lot of hunt & peck that I'd rather not go through. Anyone got better info?

Hi Jereth.  Good question.  As I remember it from the programming of a GM36 patch manager I did years ago you are right, the digital pot side of things uses a 8bit chip which has a range of 0-255.  The actual hands on pot on the panel is a standard type which simply feeds a DC value to a small ADC chip which then converts that to an 8-bit value in the range of 0-255.  That is 256 values with the first being 0.

In essence any pot acting as a switch or selector will divide this into regular blocks just as you did yourself.  Any channel set up as an on/off switch will use 0-127 and 128-255.  Any pot which is a 4-way switch such as the Fx selection will use 0-63, 64-127, 128-191 and 192-255.  Any value passed within those ranges will get the selection as you want.  Continuous values will use the full range of 0-255.  Your modulation speed has a restricted 64 steps so will be set up in blocks of 4.  That's 0-3, 4-7, 8-11, 12-15 ... 248-251, 252-255.  I do recall something about there being one rogue channel which carried two values in uneven blocks but this is going back a few years now.  We should be able to sort it out without too much trouble if you find I am right.  

The message 4, Delay Time, makes no sense to me!  The GM40 manual says "Delay Time, 128 steps, 51 ms to 1360 ms" but the GM36 says "Delay Time, 128 steps, 51 ms to 1360 ms" and the FSM432 say "Delay Time, 10 ms-steps (double steps), 5 ms to 1360 ms".  I think we might assume that the setup has change a little with the GM40, or there may even be a typo, it isn't unknown in those manuals.  And I can't see how either of those ranges splits out into a logical pattern for an 8bit setup.     I wonder if there is some sort of issue with real world times being at the mercy of the amp's digital clock time so the values don't come out as straight matches to their digital counterpart?  Answers on a postcard...

None of that takes you forward very far I'm afraid but I think it at least confirms your view of how the setup works.

Ah, now that begins to make a bit more sense to me. So, essentially, when we switch the FSM432 from patch to stompbox mode, we're telling it to switch from sending patch changes to sending controller changes. My FCB1010 should be coming in today, so I'll have plenty of time to mess with it. This will get me a lot closer. I did end up writing H&K for the same info I asked for on here, but I have yet to hear anything back at all. Sadly, that seems to be nothing unusual, in my recent experience.

I know what you mean about responses from support.  H&K can seem to be in the same boat as most other manufacturers but it isn't so in my experience.  For some reason they are very poor at responding to direct emails, and they aren't good at responding to requests on their own site.  However, if you find their Facebook page and post your query on there, because it is open to the public to read, you usually find a response in a day or two marketing aspects like Trade Shows permitting.  I have always got a response that way even to pretty searching questions about technical stuff which normally manufacturers sidestep.  They really are a helpful and open bunch when you get them talking.

Have a look here:  H&K Facebook Page  Use the "Posts" area and make a public post there asking your question.  They should get back to you in a day or two.

Your idea on the patch/controller changes seems sound to me though I'm no MIDI expert. I just know the hardware and software sides at a low level rather than the overall environment. One thing that often confuses people, (not yourself), is that the patches are actually stored exclusively on the amp and not on the FSM432 or any other control unit. The amp responds to a request to select an entire patch, or it responds to a request to change just a single parameter. I think that implies that in either case the footswitch is only sending a single message with a single value in it.

So, tentatively speaking, here is how I'd like to set my FCB1010 (W/UnO EEPROM) up:

Code:


Upper 5 Foot Switches - Stomp Box Mode

   Controller # 12 = Mod-FX Type
      6 - 0-31 (15) = Chorus
      7 - 32-63 (45) = Flanger
      8 - 64-95 (80) = Phaser
      9 - 96-127 (110) = Tremolo

   Controller # 53 = Delay On/Off
      10 - latch mode

Lower 5 Foot Switches - Preset Mode

   Patches 1 - 5
   
Treadle 1 = Modulation Intensity
   Controller # 1
      0-127
      
Treadle 2 = Delay Volume
   Controller # 28
      0-127
      
External Treadle = Volume (Soft)
   Controller # 7
      0-127
      
External Switch = Boost On/Off
   Controller # 64
      latch mode


Keep in mind that I already have a Mooer Treadle controller and a no-name latching footswitch that I plan to add to the FCB, hence the extra entries. Does this seem feasible?

I found this great page that goes a little further in-depth into the Midi end of things:

128 WAYS MIDI WILL CHANGE YOUR LIFE AS A LIVE GUITARIST



It's really just for the the GM36, so there are some controls missing that are present in the GM40. But, it gives more info than the manual does. Adding it to this thread for posterity.

Again, for posterity: The two "Switch" ports on the back of the FCB1010 are NOT for adding external expression pedals or switches.    They are for running cables to an amp for switching it.    They're not inputs, they're outputs!    Very cool feature, if a little useless for this particular implementation.  

Because of this I had to make a couple of minor changes:

Code:

Upper 5 Foot Switches - Stomp Box Mode

   Controller # 12 = Mod-FX Type - Momentary
      6 - 0-31 (15) = Chorus
      7 - 32-63 (45) = Flanger
      8 - 64-95 (80) = Phaser
      9 - 96-127 (110) = Tremolo

   Controller # 53 = Boost On/Off - latch mode
      10 - 64

Lower 5 Foot Switches - Preset Mode

   Patches 1 - 5
  
Treadle 1 = Modulation Intensity
   Controller # 1
      0-127
      
Treadle 2 = Delay Volume
   Controller # 28
      0-127

I may switch the upper and lower decks so that the stomp boxes are at the bottom and patch changes are at the top, I'm not sure. I'm still debating with myself.

I also used the following editor from: https://www.fcb1010.uno/ with an M-Audio Midisport Uno USB to Midi interface cable, which made things so much easier!

Overall, I'm pretty ecstatic over the outcome. Worked like a charm and opens a lot of possibilities!

Finally got everything programmed to my liking so I thought i would share my setting for anyone who, like I was, is looking for a good jumping off point for their own programming of this unit with this mod.

Here's the schema: Upper deck 1-5 patch selection. Lower deck stomp box mode (1 chorus, 2 phaser, 3 flanger, 4 tremolo, 5 boost). Treadle A = Mod-FX intensity, Treadle B = Delay volume.

You can find the file here: FCB1010-UnO-H&K_GMD40-Mapping.lgp

Once again, I used the FCB/UNO CONTROL CENTER FOR THE FCB1010 for programming and import/export of the above file.

Top man Jereth, that's some good work there. It's great to have the info posted openly even though you aren't getting too much response yet. I always think that there may well be a lot of people coming across this through Google searches who benefit from your efforts even though you never know about it. That's one reason why I always post at length to make everything as clear and unambiguous as possible. There is less chance of someone finding the info casually and misinterpreting it as they will do with a 1 line textspeak post. (No, not everyone needs to do that but I know I'm thought of as overly prissy for the lengths of some posts I make.)

Looking at your posts it's clear that I got the 0-255 thing wrong. My memory kept saying 0-127 but the logic said it should be full 8bit. I remember now it's because of the underlying MIDI message format. Every status byte has a 1 in the most significant bit and every data byte has a 0 as identifiers. This only leaves the other 7bits to carry the value, hence 0-127. Told you I was no MIDI expert! Thanks to you that's cleared up.

And kudos for posting the associated settings file for anyone to use as a starting point. Let's now see if anyone else actually uses this setup.

Much obliged, bordonbert. Actually, I rather enjoy your long-winded-ness when it comes to the technical topics involved. I know you get a lot of shit for your more scientific approach from some, but I'll take the empirical facts over ignorance-based woo any day of the week.

As for the setup, yeah, it's a little quirky, but then, I'm a quirky kind of guy. I like things that are set up for me, specifically, and this suits me to a T ... at the moment. Next week, I'll probably come up with a new idea and start tweaking again. I'm kinda like that. I shared the file because it was exactly what I was looking for when I first set out to learn the basics of using the FCB1010/UnO with the GMD40, but couldn't find. That's always frustrating. So, hopefully I'll have saved some other poor sap from another fruitless search by posting it.

Yes, folks find these forums and threads through Google and several other ways. That's how I got here, myself, after all, and how I ended up finding the FCB1010UnO User's Group on groups.io as well. I've found that putting stuff like this up for posterity can be a hugely useful boon for those that come after us, looking for the same information.

Thanks for the kudos. I take that as high praise coming from you.

Hi Jereth, I would like to get your example programming file, Bu t i can't download it. My error?
Thanks.

WimVenema wrote:Hi Jereth, I would like to get your example programming file, Bu t i can't download it. My error?
Thanks.

Not your error. I was hosting this on my home server and have, in the interim, deleted it. Evidently, I didn't make a backup of it since I can't find it anymore. However, the mapping file is only settings that the board sends as midi messages - basically sending numbers. So, it really has nothing to do with the settings on your amp, per se. So, as posted above, my mapping ended up as the following and has remained static since then:

Code:

Upper 5 Foot Switches - Stomp Box Mode

 Controller # 12 = Mod-FX Type - Momentary
 6 - 0-31 (15) = Chorus
 7 - 64-95 (80) = Phaser
 8 - 32-63 (45) = Flanger
 9 - 96-127 (110) = Tremolo

 Controller # 53 = Delay On/Off
 10 - latch mode

Lower 5 Foot Switches - Preset Mode

 Patches 1 - 5
 
Treadle 1 = Modulation Intensity
 Controller # 1
 0-127
 
Treadle 2 = Delay Volume
 Controller # 28
 0-127

Using the correct software (also stated above) this is pretty easy to type in by hand using a laptop or PC.

Good luck and thanks for your interest!

Hi Fellow Grandmeister users.
With the help of (ao) Jereth, i've got it.
My aim was to "just" switch to the presets that are stored in de GM and on my I-pad. Stompboxes can be switched on-of, in those patches where they are used, volume can be controled up until the value they are used for in the preset. Attached the Sysex file :-)

Jereth wrote:

WimVenema wrote:Hi Jereth, I would like to get your example programming file, Bu t i can't download it. My error?
Thanks.

Not your error. I was hosting this on my home server and have, in the interim, deleted it. Evidently, I didn't make a backup of it since I can't find it anymore. However, the mapping file is only settings that the board sends as midi messages - basically sending numbers. So, it really has nothing to do with the settings on your amp, per se. So, as posted above, my mapping ended up as the following and has remained static since then:

Code:

Upper 5 Foot Switches - Stomp Box Mode

 Controller # 12 = Mod-FX Type - Momentary
 6 - 0-31 (15) = Chorus
 7 - 64-95 (80) = Phaser
 8 - 32-63 (45) = Flanger
 9 - 96-127 (110) = Tremolo

 Controller # 53 = Delay On/Off
 10 - latch mode

Lower 5 Foot Switches - Preset Mode

 Patches 1 - 5
 
Treadle 1 = Modulation Intensity
 Controller # 1
 0-127
 
Treadle 2 = Delay Volume
 Controller # 28
 0-127

Using the correct software (also stated above) this is pretty easy to type in by hand using a laptop or PC.

Good luck and thanks for your interest!

Hi Jareth, I have a FCB1010 and have been using it with my GMD40 just to change presets and use the volume pedal...  I want to go towards the setup you have listed here but i have a couple questions, i have never messed with midi at all...
It seems you are happy with the results, is this setup better than what the FSM 432 mkiii would be in your opinion?
Does uno make it possible for the LED lights to function properly when turning the effects on and off?
Do you see any reason to go with the new Uno2 chip instead of this version you have?
I guess I'm also wondering if i need the uno control center to program, or can i do it with the FCB1010 itself without connecting to a computer?

It seems pretty straight forward, but am a complete newb so any advice or help is much appreciated.